Why does the Nextcloud Windows client require a restart each update?

[robnicholsonmalt]

@bb77

I really can’t say much negative about the desktop client, as I’ve never experienced most of the issues discussed here in the forums. However, I’m just a home user running it on Linux (currently Fedora, previously Arch and Ubuntu), I don’t use Virtual Files, and I don’t have an enterprise like environment, just two users, no group folders, no external storage etc…

Latest version - causes Windows Explorer to crash on right-click on all Windows 10 systems as far as I can tell:

https://help.nextcloud.com/t/desktop-app-causing-windows-explorer-to-crash

This level of poor quality is really going to hurt

[bb77]

Yeah, what can I say, I saw this thread too, and I agree that major bugs like this should definitely be caught before the software is released, especially since the desktop client is an application meant to be installed and maintained by end users, with auto-updates enabled by default.

[robnicholsonmalt]

I personally think the release schedule is too aggressive. Which makes this restart issue even more painful.

[bb77]

I shut down my PC every night. But okay, I get it, reboots are a nightmare because imagine, having to grab a coffee at the office without bringing your laptop because it’s rebooting, or having to boot up your PC and open all the applications first if you want to look important at Starbucks

Sorry, couldn’t help it

[sven1234]

Did (Linux) people not make fun of Windows because every update required a reboot?
The funny bit is: the installation app tells you that it will close explorer in order to avoid the restart and in the end asks you to restart.

Restarts are annoying in times of tablets and smartphones and hibernate. Nextcloud client is more Windows 98 in that regard.

[bb77]

@sven1234

Did (Linux) people not make fun of Windows because every update required a reboot?

Yeah, and I’ve always found these jokes a bit silly, even as a Linux user, because let’s be honest, at least after upgrades that involve a lot of system packages, a reboot is usually quicker and easier than having to manually restart all the services and applications involved.

And yes, there are tools like needrestart and kernel live patching, but even if you use them, you should still do a planned reboot from time to time.

So even in 2024, no system will run forever without rebooting, and even Android and iOS require reboots for system updates.

[tflidd]

For me on Windows the Windows Subsystem for Linux manages to push the CPUs to 100% after some time, sometimes it helps to restart just WSL, sometimes it needs a restart. If Windows updates stuff in the background, it can start to behave a bit strangely, that is a sign that you need to restart.

I’m not expert enough to tell, if there is a solution or if there is a simple solution to that issue. Would you ask a developer to try to solve this during a month? Is this enough? Or would you prefer other issues to be solved first?
Unfortunately, the current process is not very transparent in public, so we can only suppose that they have done reasonable choices, especially since the desktop client is used by their enterprise customers as well.

[sven1234]

@bb77

So even in 2024, no system will run forever without rebooting, and even Android and iOS require reboots for system updates.

True. The nextcloud client however, is not a system but just an app and is compared with apps of the same kind. Thus the same expectations and technical possibilities apply. Hence I can understand users that ask, why something which works for other apps with the same functionality, does not for the nextcloud app.

One thing I find confusing is that if you install the nextcloud app, windows asks for permission to install a package. The package name for most apps includes the app name, i.e. the user can identify easily that the package is the one he clicked on. Nextcloud however, shows some crypting package name instead of “nextcloud”.

[bb77]

Yes, I understand all that, but I can’t answer the technical details of why certain things are the way they are in the Nextcloud client. Check out the issue tracker on GitHub, the reboot thing has been and probably still is discussed extensively there. And if there isn’t an open issue for a the cryptic name, which I suspect is just the name of the msi package the updater downloads, open a new one.

[robnicholsonmalt]

I too shut my PC down every night but many don’t. But that’s not the point, Nextcloud nags on start-up and often. Most other cloud sync clients don’t need reboots when they update - OneDrive, Google Drive or Dropbox.

[robnicholsonmalt]

@sven1234

The funny bit is: the installation app tells you that it will close explorer in order to avoid the restart and in the end asks you to restart.

Indeed… whilst having it close Explorer is scary, I used to do it and the update still insisted on restarting - every time.

[robnicholsonmalt]

@sven1234

One thing I find confusing is that if you install the nextcloud app, windows asks for permission to install a package.

This is an important point - many companies are moving away from allowing end users admin rights for understandable fears about ransomware. Any application that requires admin rights is going to get frowned upon.

[robnicholsonmalt]

@bb77

Check out the issue tracker on GitHub, the reboot thing has been and probably still is discussed extensively there.

Considering the period of instability recently, I’d council taking a step back and looking at the Nextcloud client architecture - seriously. I’ve just lost a Nextcloud client because of instability. This recent right-click issues comes at the end of long list

1. Client freezes and prevents all file access on computer (the showstopper that lost the client).
2. The timestamp issue whereby Nextcloud doesn’t maintain the milliseconds value and therefore Excel thinks somebody else has changed the file.
3. Client crashes when copying lots of new files using a tool like robocopy.
4. Create a new folder and you end up with the client removing it or it ends up as “New folder”. Rename a new folder quickly after creating it and you often end up with old and new names.
5. Nextcloud stops synchronising so cloud copy is out of sync.
6. Performance is measurably slower than OneDrive which is one of the slowest.
7. Often gets stuck “Preparing sync” and trying to open a non-local file ends up with “Cloud provider failed”.
8. Frequent updates requiring annoying restarts.
9. Update always adds the icon to the desktop.
10. No way to get back to top of activities window after lots of activity so you can’t see the most recent activity.

I feel a real cad about posting those but this level of instability means the client looses faith and goes elsewhere. This client has been more than happy with Nextcloud for over two years - it’s the recent lack of quality control that’s sent them over the edge.

I created this post in December 2022 and we’re still talking about it.

[bb77]

Well, at least you prioritised the issues reasonably by putting the reboot issue at number 8 and the desktop icon at number 9 on your list

Seriously, I don’t think there’s any point in discussing this any further here because nobody denies that these issues exist, and that many of them can at least make working with Nextcloud more difficult compared to other solutions. Also, many users would certainly be happy if the more cosmetic issues 8 and 9 could be resolved in the near future.

However, we can’t solve these issues in the forums, so I don’t see the point in complaining about them here over and over again.

[tflidd]

@bb77

Yes, I understand all that, but I can’t answer the technical details of why certain things are the way they are in the Nextcloud client. Check out the issue tracker on GitHub, the reboot thing has been and probably still is discussed extensively there. And if there isn’t an open issue for a the cryptic name, which I suspect is just the name of the msi package the updater downloads, open a new one.

I have marked this as solution because this is how far we can get on the forum. We are users, not the developers. So if you want to discuss the technical details, help implement new and better solutions, please go to the repository and check with the developers directly.

If you want to stick to Nextcloud but don’t want to use the client, there are other clients which hookup directly via webdav, perhaps for some that might be a better experience.

[tflidd]

@robnicholsonmalt

I’d council taking a step back and looking at the Nextcloud client architecture - seriously. I’ve just lost a Nextcloud client because of instability.

Then go for it, help out doing something. If you earn money with it, you can perhaps afford a developer to work on your issues, or get an enterprise subscription, do it yourself…

We are just users here as everybody else, so we don’t steer the development of Nextcloud. We can actively try to do things to improve things.

[robnicholsonmalt]

I see Nextcloud client 3.12.3 has been released:

https://github.com/nextcloud/desktop/releases/tag/v3.12.3

I’m assuming this contains the fix for the right-click issue. These Github based release notes aren’t the most user friendly to read but I’ve mentioned that before:

https://github.com/nextcloud/desktop/pull/6585

I’ve just had my last Nextcloud customer ask to move elsewhere. I only had three free installations. So at least I’ll be out of your hair very shortly Yes, I know they were expecting the world for nothing but the offer was there.

[robnicholsonmalt]

@tflidd

We are just users here as everybody else, so we don’t steer the development of Nextcloud. We can actively try to do things to improve things.

Users don’t steer the future of a product? I would hope that they have a lot of input into it though.

[tflidd]

@robnicholsonmalt

Users don’t steer the future of a product? I would hope that they have a lot of input into it though.

In the long term perhaps, if nobody uses it. There is an important impact by all the apps developed and contributed by the community. But the core part is developed by the Nextcloud company, and there is no public feature roadmap, nor any public discussion here on the forum. It does not mean, that they don’t pick up ideas or things that are around in the community.

For me steering is more active, what does e.g. comes with the next release NC 29 and what is planned for NC30? So you are a user as well, can you tell me?