I have this document (I tried .docx, .doc and .odt) which is 205 pages long, 1,3MB as .odt, 4,6MB as .doc. On Nextcloud 10.0.3 with
Collabora Online 1.1.17 (docker image created on 2016-11-07) this document opens as expected in the online GUI, on a 11.0.1 Nexcloud instance with Collabora 1.1.25 (docker image created on 2017-01-25) it does not. Shorter documents are editable as expected.
Besides the max 10 user/20 connections limit, is there now maybe also a document length limit in the latest collabora docker image?
Hi,
any news to that. I read about 100 users, but cant find the link. What is the actual status? If are only 10 docs at the same time opened possible, its not usable since this could reach one or a few persons. So i agree all guys before. My decision for nextcloud was because of saying it has collab with document creating and editing.
Please offer a SMB version of Collabora that is affordable for such organizations. A five figure sum is just not in reach for organisations of that size.
You can order at https://nextcloud.com/enterprise/order/ at reasonable prices, under 8K/year for 100 users. Order 3 years at once & you get 15% discount, too
Developing and supporting good software costs money. We will most certainly try to lower prices when we can and if you have thoughts on how and what, you can let me know. But just think how many contracts for 8K we have to sign to pay over 30 people!
@opeeters there is no length limitation, for sure. If the document doesnāt open it must be a bug.
WRT the limit to 10 documents and Collaboraās business model - Collabora has decided to work for free for home users and businesses up to 10-20 users. That is great as they are under NO obligation to work for free for anyone. For bigger businesses, well, it isnāt unreasonable to pay if others work for you, right?
Especially considering their price is very fair, much lower than Microsoft Office for example. And the code is all open source so you can even avoid paying them completely if you donāt want to by downloading the code and building it all yourself.
Of course it makes no sense to feel entitled to the fruits of their work without paying for it. Open source is about freedom, not free beer.
I am very happy that we at Nextcloud donāt have to do things like putting in limitations in our standard packages to stop companies from freeloading but please realize that the fact that quite some companies are using it without paying means we have a lot less developers making Nextcloud better than we could have had if we had made it harder to not contribute in any way.
So maybe I should ask all of you: what do you think? Should we put in some limitations for SMB so they are forced to pay us so we can pay more developers to make Nextcloud better?
You can order at https://nextcloud.com/enterprise/order/ at reasonable prices, under 8K/year for 100 users. Order 3 years at once & you get 15% discount, too
Well, there is still a gap for the 10-50 users range. Below 10 is probably tiny enough to get away without support (like with CODE), but above that would also need a bit of love. Wouldnāt that get you some more customers too?
Of course it makes no sense to feel entitled to the fruits of their
work without paying for it. Open source is about freedom, not free beer.
Sure, nobody should be. These people probably misunderstood the difference between OSS and āFreewareā.
So maybe I should ask all of you: what do you think? Should we put in
some limitations for SMB so they are forced to pay us so we can pay
more developers to make Nextcloud better?
How about the opposite: An additional subscription tier for 10-50 users?
Iām not against that idea, and it would make sense to offer something however I understand the support offered have to be lower for 10-50 users. SLAs would be different amongst other things as itās simply not cost effective to support small groups. Fine if all you need is Collabora and the occasional 72hr guaranteed response though
True, weād like to cater to that but as a company weāre not set up for it: most of these would need rather ābasicā support, like āhow do I share a fileā style, rather than āwe discovered this bug here is the full log and analysis please fix itā which is what we offer (only 3rd level support!). We donāt have the capacity to reply to all those support requests.
There are hosting providers however, as well as some partners of us who would be glad to helpā¦
SLAs would be different amongst other things as itās simply not cost effective to support small groups.
Sure, support level should be set accordingly to the price paid.
We donāt have the capacity to reply to all those support requests.
indeed, basic support of that type should be handled by somebody else, not 3rd-level support. An escalation system would be a good way to get done with these requests and have a way up if the problem is more serious.
There are hosting providers however, as well as some partners of us who would be glad to helpā¦
How many of them host Collabora and sell the Outlook plugin for example? The latter is only available with a Nextcloud subscription at the moment as already talked about here:
If weād get a request from a provider I think we can handle that.
Same for a partner who would want to offer smaller contracts, I guessā¦ Though weāre getting a lot of partner requests at the moment which need a lot of time to process, too.
Could someone please confirm the actual limits? NC website says soemthing to the effect of 100 users but is it actually just 10?
Its such a sneaky way to put it on the website though (as if you could have 100 users) when you actually just allow 10 users. Just be upfront about what you offer. I love open source and support them if I can but pulling this kind of tricks on potential clients isnāt winning NC/Collabora any favors
That is stating it doesnāt support 100 users and that limitations are in place. Presumably kept vague so it doesnāt need to be updated if the limit changes.
Jasonā¦ it would sound pretty bad if it said Collabora doesnāt support my 10 users (which is the fact), so the PR team came up with their usual deceptive marketing strategies. Actually 3-4 people working on some documents is enough to go over that limit. Now Iām not one to complain over free software just the fact that NC removed documents app and is pushing a barely usable replacement -using what is questionable marketing- is whatās bothering me.
Erm nope. The documents app hasnāt been maintained as itās based on libraries that have in themselves lost maintainers. Thereās a topic about it if you search; NC didnāt intentionally remove anything
The marketing came under scrutiny a while back and that is the outcome of that discussion - thereās a topic on that too if it wasnāt this one further above.
Jasonā¦ Iām new here and Iām not trying to derail this discussion so Iāll just conclude by saying that scrutiny isnāt enough. The you-know-whoās need to goā¦
Thanks, will be releasing a limitless LibreOffice Online docker version soonā¦
That would be really nice work, thanks for the effort.
I am not impressed with some of the marketing hyperbole either. The missing guest app that was announced as part of Nextcloud 12 is another example. It is neither part of/compatible with Nextcloud 12 nor available in the app store. Many news outlets took over this information without checking (good journalism eh?) it either.
Please donāt do this kind of PR, it gives a valuable project a really bad taste.
Yeah, Iām not happy about the Guest app still not being finished either. It just took longer than planned Really sorry for that. Of course, help is welcome! The code is in github.
wrt Collabora, we nowhere promise that the CODE is anything but a developer edition that is suitable for home and very small business users so I think the communication is fine, but pull requests to the Collaboraonline page on our website are very welcome. I agree itād be nice to increase the limits perhaps to about 50 users/100 connections or so, I will ask our Collabora friends if that would be possible.
But note that most companies only use about 10% of their connections - if you have 50 employees, how often will ALL OF THEM be using the Collabora app at the same time on individual documents? I bet that 10 documents/20 connections is enough for the average 50 people company 99% of the time.
Really sorry for that. Of course, help is welcome! The code is in github.