Lazy people don't deserve help

I am trying most of the time to keep it cool, but i have notice to things happening more and more here:

  • The laziness of posting a complete message: no server definition, no config files, just a title and not core message…

I can understand having troubles been myself a total noob in linux apache nginx mysql nextcloud world a few years ago, but i can’t understand the way some people are asking help with empty facts cut and past message …

You need help, deserve it !!!
Be polite, clear, focus on error, have a little respect for the community who’s trying to help.

  • The easy way out: when something is not working, as simple as vhost definition in apache stop redirecting people to something else like a snap or a vm …

Someone having issue with gentoo vhost configuration, go use a vm…

VM are nice, but a fine tune server based on a real distro will always be more efficient than a VM !!!

And at least, facing your problem you will learn something

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Well I’m new at all this so even much of what you said there doesn’t make sense to me.

I’m not sure what it’s like here but on support forums I am on for other software there is something that REALLY irks me.

That is people bumping their “please help” messages after 6 minutes ! As if volunteers sit around all day just waiting for support questions to answer them with lightning speed.

Probably everybody contributing over a longer period of time comes to this point. There is always the trade off between marketing and common sense, one the one hand they want to make the installation as easy as possible, on the other you’d like to say to get some basic linux knowledge first and do a few steps on your local network before putting a server online.

About these incomplete posts, should we ignore them, mark them as incomplete, ask politely for more information or just close it? In general I prefer a solution where the user has at least some sort of feedback, so if we close or tag we should have a post or something that explain why we do it and what can people do about it.


Some of the form is downright redundant for certain questions. Not everybody is cut out to help. Demanding the completed form, or the lesser, the missing pertinent information, is probably better than ignore-ance. Some people will abuse it, some people will get better, and some will be helped and thankful. I think not having some gratitude shown for a completed request is worse.

A good search that looks for answers, like Amazon’s question system for customer/manufacturer Q&A is good. haven’t seen enough to complain but topics that stay on topic makes posts worth a lot more. Modified titles by mods or submods would make looking at search results a lot less exhausting, especially when problem and cause are well defined when resolved.

well as much as i do understand @stratege1401 and his anger (I’m not free of it, as well - and i feel bad about it) I’d like to contradrict. like sometimes someone must take the first steps into a new region (like me) and get used to the things that seems to be established there.

i sometimes add the tag missing_information to those without any further comment… like if they are interested they could ask which info is missing or such. but does it help? maybe sometimes.

what i really can’t stand are ppl who are just venting off b/c they arent helped- so they blame devs, forums, everyones… except for themselves. you prolly wont find any helpful answer from me with those guys. and i admire ppl being able to answer, though.


JUNE 2018 - JUNE 2019 !

I was harsh, i still am.

Anniversary time :wink: Champagne !!

So @stratege1401 How’s the grumpy going?

What’s this all about? VMs run real distros, did you know that?
VMs are the big equalizer! Probably the key reason why Nextcloud has so many users.
From RasPI to big iron, type-1 and type-2, VirtualBox, KVM, ESXi/vSphere, Hyper-V - pick your favorite…

You get a server running properly - take a snapshot.
Need to install a questionable update - just do it. It didn’t work - roll back.
On an average 100 users/500GB NC installation this takes under 15 minutes…
I can just hear “But this way you don’t learn anything!”… Try it…

To generalize: if there are 5 different ways to tackle an issue - take a snapshot and try them all in sequence. Rolling back every time it fails… My grand kids starting school taught me this approach…

Of course, if you are the coding god, you’ll have the advantage, but who is?

Very much so!
To paraphrase it: you need to be Kernighan to point your finger to the sky
and proclaim “It shall not be easy!”

I don’t think that discussion is leading to anything, old topic, based on an opinion, …

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