# Talk (spreed) without HPB can't establish Audio-Video connection but text chat works **URL:** \ **Category:** đź’¬ Talk (spreed)\ **Tags:** talk-hpb, debian, turn, nc31, talk-app, firefox\ **Created:** [May 8, 2025, 8:12pm UTC](https://help.nextcloud.com/t/talk-spreed-without-hpb-cant-establish-audio-video-connection-but-text-chat-works/224489 "2025-05-08T20:12:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![timreeves](https://help.nextcloud.com/user_avatar/help.nextcloud.com/timreeves/32/1491_2.png) [@timreeves](https://help.nextcloud.com/u/timreeves)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2025, 8:12pm UTC](https://help.nextcloud.com/t/talk-spreed-without-hpb-cant-establish-audio-video-connection-but-text-chat-works/224489/1 "2025-05-08T20:12:03Z")
Nextcloud version _(eg, 24.0.1)_: `31.0.4` Talk Server version _(eg, 14.0.2)_: `21.0.4` Custom Signaling server configured: `No` Custom TURN server configured: `No` Custom STUN server configured: `No` Operating system _(eg, Windows/Ubuntu/…)_: `Debian 12` Browser name and version _(eg, Chrome v101)_: `Firefox 138.0.1` We can use text chat, and each of us sees their own webcam picture, each micro works, but the call can’t be established, each sees only the rotating circle instead of the webcam picture of the other person. I’ve not got it to work yet, never used it before. Steps to replicate it: 1. Log in to NC installation using Firefox 2. Select Talk and try to start a call with a friend who is also logged in 3. Up in the left corner, it says that the partner is “In a conversation” The output of your Nextcloud log in **Admin \> Logging** or errors in nextcloud.log in /var/www/: ```auto Log is empty, I run a clean shop :) ``` The output of your Apache/nginx/system log in `/var/log/ ____ `: ```auto proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:00:45 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2Fowncloud.reeves.one%2Fcall%2Fgzceupn9 HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:20:39 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2Fexample.com%2Fcall%2Fgzceupn9 HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:20:40 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/spreed/api/v3/signaling/gzceupn9 HTTP/2.0" 409 109 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:24:27 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2Faijdp7md HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:25:06 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2Fgzceupn9 HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:25:09 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2Ffm93i2hu HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:25:09 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/references/resolve?reference=%20https%3A%2F%2Fnextcloud-talk.readthedocs.io%2Fen%2Flatest%2Fbot-list%2F%0A HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:25:09 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/references/resolve?reference=%20https%3A%2F%2Fnextcloud.com%2Ftalk-desktop-install%0A HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:25:43 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2Fgzceupn9 HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:28:14 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2F3xpewxie HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:28:37 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2F56ubp2ts HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:138.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/138.0" proxy_access_ssl_log:77.11.109.176 - - [08/May/2025:20:32:59 +0200] "GET /ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https:%2F%2F[owncloud.reeves.one](http://example.com)%2Fcall%2F56ubp2ts HTTP/2.0" 404 88 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Ubuntu; Linux x86_64; rv:136.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/136.0" ``` Your browser log if relevant (javascript console log, network log, etc.): ```auto GET https://example.com/ocs/v2.php/apps/dav/api/v1/events/upcoming?location=https://example.com/call/56ubp2ts 404 Object { message: "Request failed with status code 404", name: "AxiosError", code: "ERR_BAD_REQUEST", config: {…}, request: XMLHttpRequest, response: {…}, status: 404, stack: "", … } ``` ---
**Author:** ![wwe](https://help.nextcloud.com/user_avatar/help.nextcloud.com/wwe/32/72963_2.png) [@wwe](https://help.nextcloud.com/u/wwe)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 8:22pm UTC](https://help.nextcloud.com/t/talk-spreed-without-hpb-cant-establish-audio-video-connection-but-text-chat-works/224489/2 "2025-05-13T20:22:53Z")
hi @timreeves the component you are looking for is not HPB but rather STUN/TURN server which allow connection between two client without a “_direct line of sight_” - means different networks, firewall and NAT in between.. Please work through this docs to understand the issue ### good turn and stun explanation - [Free WebRTC TURN Server - Open Relay Project | Open Relay Project - Free WebRTC TURN Server](https://www.metered.ca/tools/openrelay/#what-is-a-turn-server) - [https://www.metered.ca/tools/openrelay/stun-servers-and-friends](https://www.metered.ca/tools/openrelay/stun-servers-and-friends) - [https://ourcodeworld.com/articles/read/1526/how-to-test-online-whether-a-stun-turn-server-is-working-properly-or-not](https://ourcodeworld.com/articles/read/1526/how-to-test-online-whether-a-stun-turn-server-is-working-properly-or-not) ## Nextcloud Talk docs > **[Overview - Nextcloud Talk API documentation](https://nextcloud-talk.readthedocs.io/en/latest/TURN/)** ---
**Author:** ![timreeves](https://help.nextcloud.com/user_avatar/help.nextcloud.com/timreeves/32/1491_2.png) [@timreeves](https://help.nextcloud.com/u/timreeves)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 9:10pm UTC](https://help.nextcloud.com/t/talk-spreed-without-hpb-cant-establish-audio-video-connection-but-text-chat-works/224489/3 "2025-05-13T21:10:08Z")
Thanks for your reply @wwe. The first article linked states “WebRTC TURN Server is required to relay the traffic between the peers when direct connection cannot be established among them.” I was rather thinking that both PCs are directly connected to the internet. But one of them is using a VPN (NordVPN) - would that mean that a WebRTC connection can’t be established? And a further idea: My browser, and I think my friends too, use the plugin “WebRTC Leak Shield” - that sounds like a good candidate to be causing the problem. We’ll try deactivating them. Cheers, Tim ---
**Author:** ![awelzel](https://help.nextcloud.com/user_avatar/help.nextcloud.com/awelzel/32/74585_2.png) [@awelzel](https://help.nextcloud.com/u/awelzel)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 10:25pm UTC](https://help.nextcloud.com/t/talk-spreed-without-hpb-cant-establish-audio-video-connection-but-text-chat-works/224489/4 "2025-05-13T22:25:13Z")
“Connected to the internet” usually means the PCs are connected to a router which does NAT (network address translations), so the PCs are not directly “visible” on the internet but have a private IP address like 192.168.0.2 or 10.0.0.7 or similar and the router will translate between the public internet and your local, private network. STUN/TURN (“Session Traversal Utilities for NAT” and “Traversal Using Relays around NAT”) are methods to allow traffic to PCs behind NAT by acting as a relay server which accepts incoming connections from the PCs and transfers data from one PC to the other. However this usually works well only for a few people at the same time because every participant needs to send and recieve data from/to all other participants in the meeting. If you want to do sessions with 3 or more people, the HPB provides an additional “signaling” server which handles the traffic. So in short: 1. You usually must always provide a TURN server on a public server as a relay (for example Coturn in Linux which does also STUN besides TURN) which also should be protected with a password/secret. 2. If you want to do sessions with many people at the same time, you should also consider the HPB. I also wrote an article about how to set up everything since the Docker container for the HPB did not work for me and the manual setup is not that hard. You may just start with TURN and if you lated decide to try out the HPB also, you can extend your setup at any time: > **[Nextcloud Talk with Coturn and self hosted signaling server (High Performance...](https://arnowelzel.de/en/nextcloud-talk-with-coturn-and-self-hosted-signaling-server-high-performance-backend)** > > Note: The following guide was originally created in 2020 using Ubuntu 20.04 and later updated to Ubuntu 24.04. Older versions of Ubuntu may require the use of separate sources for go and Janus, which provide up-to-date versions. With the “Talk” app,... ---
**Author:** ![wwe](https://help.nextcloud.com/user_avatar/help.nextcloud.com/wwe/32/72963_2.png) [@wwe](https://help.nextcloud.com/u/wwe)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2026, 8:33pm UTC](https://help.nextcloud.com/t/talk-spreed-without-hpb-cant-establish-audio-video-connection-but-text-chat-works/224489/5 "2026-01-16T20:33:15Z")